Posts by Marvin Shilmer

12

A WT "prophecy" that finally came true?

by eyeuse2badub in

at long last, after 140 years of failed prophecies, it appears that the borg finally got one right!

recall the odd little article published back in the november 15th, 2013 wt about the 7 shepherds 8 dukes (anti-type) and the evil assyrian (anti-type) and some silly nonsense about the assyrians attack on the vulnerable wtbts.

page 20 paragraph 17 of that strange article contained this foreboding prophecy from the faithful and discreet slave, (anti-type);.

Marvin Shilmer

Watchtower's 1958 illustrated prediction that actually came true: The Urge — Watchtower’s ironic prediction

128

Looking Back In Retrospect To 1975...

by titch in

greetings, folks: so, it's been 40 years since 1975. and, if you were actively involved with the witnesses back then, the mindset of many was, that by early autumn of 1975, it would mark the anniversary of 6000 years of human existence.

and, the hope was then, that it would mark the start of the 1000-year of christ, from the heavenly realm.

but, looking back now, 40 years ago, in june of 1975, only 3 more months remained until early autumn.

Marvin Shilmer

I lived the 1975 fiasco. One incident I recall was an ongoing debate between three congregation servants (now called elders) about how long the great tribulation would last leading up to Armageddon. One felt like the GT would last about 5 years hence he expected things to really start getting nasty for JWs in 1970. The second felt like the GT would not have to last longer than 1 year. The third felt like both men were full of crap because no one could know the day and hour hence the whole discussion was speculative, including the part about 1975 potentially seeing Armageddon. The debate between these three men went on for several years. At nearly every social event where I'd encounter the three men I'd hear the discussion continue. I'd also hear it at after meetings at the KH. These guys could not let it go. All three remained as JWs. Two are deceased now and the third (the more reasonable 'no one can know the day and hour' guy) remains as active elder to this day. Last time he and I spoke I raised this incident and the long debate he had had with the other two and he said he didn't recall the three of them ever discussing the matter.

26

Sir David Eady to give judgement on the Watctower Appeal in the Otuo v Morley and Watch Tower case at the High Court tommorrow

by Adwoa Kromo in

sir david eady sitting as high court judge will hand down judgement tomorrow at 11:00am in the appeal of the decision from master leslie for refusing to strike out the claim as an abuse of process.

in his judgement in november 2014 he stated in his judgement delivered ex-tempore " i am bound to say that this case causes me a good deal of trouble".

from notes that i have from the hearing last week, i will be utterly surprised if the retired judge sir david eady takes a different view.

Marvin Shilmer

From the judgement:

"I bear in mind Mr Daniel's warning that I may be allowing myself to be diverted by a "smokescreen", but it simply illustrates why the facts need to be properly investigated after full pleadings have become available, disclosure of documents has taken place and witness statements have been exchanged. Only then will the smoke have cleared."

Mr. Daniels works for Watchtower. It's ironic that on one hand Watchtower complains judicially of a smokescreen yet simultaneously depends so heavily on smokescreen to keep the public from knowing what really happens inside its self-organized and managed shunning program.

Watchtower has done this before. In 1981 take a look at how Watchtower complained about lack of public view and review:

Criminal trials were doubtless much speedier in Israel than they are at present in countries such as the United States, where clogged courts and elaborate procedure give rise to many delays. Since the local court was situated at the city gates, there was no question about the trial being public! (Deut. 16:18-20) No doubt the public trials helped influence the judges toward carefulness and justice, qualities that sometimes vanish in secret star-chamber hearings. What about witnesses? Witnesses in Bible times were required to testify publicly. For this reason they were warned not to be influenced in their testimony by the pressure of public opinion “so as to turn aside with the crowd in order to pervert justice.” Perjury was not punished with a jail term, but with whatever punishment the false witness had sought to bring upon the defendant—even death!--(Awake, published by Watchtower, January 22, 1981, p. 17)

To this very day Watchtower disallows third-party viewing of its "judicial" activities even when requested by the accused. The very safeguards Watchtower admits as important the result of public review it rejects by disallowing third-party viewing (when it's requested).

Watchtower's tactics in the public arena are beyond contempt. The organization's leadership is overloaded with rot. It is beyond repair or reform.

9

Shunning... the thing jdubs don't speak of

by freemindfade in

standing in the back now during the wt study.

looking ahead i find it comical paragraph 14.

"...you know how disfellowshipped ones are to be treated.

Marvin Shilmer

Watchtower Shunning – Deadly by Design

65

WT October 15, 2015 - Don't believe Apostate Lies

by Designer Stubble in

the last article in this new wt, shows me that the organization is dealing with much information that is damaging them.

i am sure that the many recent lawsuits are being noticed by the r&f.. here are some gems from that article, titled the naive person believes every word.

we must be very selective about what we consider worthy of our attention.

Marvin Shilmer

Compare:
"...forwarding research material, verses extracted for Bible study, or answers to use at congregation meetings would detract from the value of each individual’s personal preparation."--The Watchtower, October 15, 2015, p. 31

With:
"... in Jehovah’s organization it is not necessary to spend a lot of time and energy in research, for there are brothers in the organization who are assigned to do that very thing, to help you who do not have so much time for this, these preparing the good material in The Watchtower and other publications of the Society."--The Watchtower, June 1, 1967, p. 338

Translates as:
It's perfectly okay for "brothers in the organization" to forward research material, verses extracted for Bible study, or answers to use at congregation meetings if they are handpicked by Watchtower to do this, but if other "brothers in the organization" forward research material, verses extracted for Bible study, or answers to use at congregation meetings it would detract from the value of each individual’s personal preparation.

5

Has Anyone Asked Bethel About Contradiction of White Blood Cells in Milk?

by berrygerry in

would intravenous insertion of milk into a human be wrong?

Marvin Shilmer

The issue has been put before Watchtower leadership so many times it's pathetic. Facts don't mean anything to those dishonest hucksters.

109

The Confederate Flag

by Simon in

the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

Marvin Shilmer

Marvin,... you are being a little naive here...
Perhaps you should take a harder look at what I've said. A much harder look.

109

The Confederate Flag

by Simon in

the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

Marvin Shilmer

What we need to be asking is how are we going to make substantive changes to achieve a truly color blind society.

Causes of the woes you mentioned faced by contemporary human society are much, much bigger and more complex than skin color.

For starters, the view from one-million miles in space is that humans are essentially a sophisticated form of bacteria eating away at planet earth's resources, which resources are not infinite.

For seconds, no matter skin color humans are, like most other life forms, very selfish.

109

The Confederate Flag

by Simon in

the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

Marvin Shilmer

is it legal to fly a flag with a swastika in Canada or America?
In the USA, yes.

29

Royal Commission into Child Abuse - Australia

by biometrics in

saw this in the paper today:.

the jehovah's witnesses church in australia is the latest religious group to come to the attention of the royal commission into institutional responses to child sexual abuse.. the child sex abuse royal commission will hold a public hearing into controversial christian group the jehovah's witnesses, next month.. the inquiry, to be held in sydney, will hear from people who were allegedly sexually abused within the jehovah's witnesses church in australia.. it will examine how the jehovah's witnesses church and its company, the watchtower bible and tract society of australia, responded to claims of child sexual abuse within the organisation.. a victorian inquiry into how churches handle child sex abuse claims has previously taken submissions from former jehovah's witnesses who alleged instances of paedophilia, sexual assault, blackmail and death threats.. the organisation has 64,000 active "disciples" in australia but has also been described as a cult.. jehovah's witnesses believe their church is the one true religion and all others are wrong.

they are among a number of religious groups which have been examined by the royal commission into institutional responses to child sexual abuse including the catholics, anglicans, australian christian churches and the salvation army.. the jehovah's witnesses australian headquarters has been contacted for comment about the inquiry which is scheduled to begin on july 27.. http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/nsw/jehovahs-witnesses-to-appear-before-sex-abuse-royal-commission-20150622-ghue73.html.

Marvin Shilmer

Imagine that. A PUBLIC HEARING!!!

What a breath of fresh air, and something the Watchtower organization does not see fit to practice of its own accord.

No. Watchtower wants all its "hearings" to be of the secret star-chamber variety where there are no neutral witnesses to what goes on there and the subject has no opportunity to have at least ONE observer for sake of inspiring carefulness and justice! This, DESPITE Watchtower decrying it when governmental organizations likewise fail to have public hearings.

See: Watchtower’s Judicial System

Watchtower prides itself in supposedly building an internal judicial system reminecent of the ancient Jewish practice of having local elders decide matters of justice. Hey Watchtower! Get THIS: Under that Jewish system elders heard cased PUBLICLY at the city gates, and meted out their decisions there too, in FULL PUBLIC VIEW.